Now that we have witnessed the two biggest retcons of the 5YL era, it’s a good moment to look back at what might be considered the inspiration for one of them.
When Jim Shooter returned to the Legion in the 70s, the Legion fandom was already MASSIVELY important… and in fact, it was a big reason why Shooter returned to comics in the first place.
So it’s not surprising that Shooter wrote his thoughts about the Legionnaires on Interlac, the first APA dedicated to the Legion which continues to this day.
To say that Interlac would be enormously influential to the Legion would be an understatement.
Members of Interlac include Dave Cockrum, Colleen Doran, Paul Levitz, Mark Waid, and of interest to this post Jim Shooter and both Tom and Mary Bierbaum.
In 1976, Jim Shooter wrote his ideas on the members of the Legion… and in 2000 (long after the end of the 5YL era), the Bierbaums did as well.
Shooter’s comments are well-known among Legion superfans, and I believe are somewhat responsible for the retcons we have seen.
So let’s have a look at the Shooter comments, at the Bierbaum response, and I’ll add whether I agree with them or not. Feel free to do the same in the comments!
Infinite thanks to Legion World for preserving this important bit of Legion lore.
COSMIC BOY
Jim Shooter: Kind of a yutz – manly, strong, secure, and yet no one suspects that he isn’t bright enough not to be. Questions of a philosophical nature rarely form in his mind. He is a good counterpart to Bouncing Boy, having that dumb ego B.B. lacks. He will shave around his ears forever. On the good side, he is dedicated, direct, and reasonable, he knows his lack of high intellect and delegates the thinking, rather than attempt it himself. He is a good leader, a quick thinker if not a deep thinker, and one who relates well to those behind him. Even as a leader he is a team player.
Bierbaums: Literally the “rock” of the Legion, the foundation, the corner stone. Quietly, unobtrusively personifies Legion heroism. Not really a natural leader, tends to let others take the initiative. Never acted on his love for Imra and let Lydda choose him.
Comics Archeology: I’ve mentioned many times that Cosmic Boy was my biggest disappointment from the original Legion run, and it looks like Shooter wasn’t too keen on him.
I have no clue what “he will shave around his ears forever” means.
The Bierbaums and Giffen positioned him as the foundation for the reconstruction of the Legion, sure, but I’m starting to think the Bierbaums were more interested in him than Giffen considering how much he fades into the background.
And obviously it wouldn’t be the Bierbaums without some unnecessary love or sex baggage added to characters, because I never saw hints about Cosmic Boy being in love with Saturn Girl.
SATURN GIRL
Shooter: Pretty much as she’s been pictured. An organizer, a businessmanlike, clever, smart competent women’s libber who scared away every guy she met until Lightning Lad with his overwhelming ego treated her like a lady, and she loved it. She is a wild, wild woman in bed, who undoubtedly has occasionally accompanied Lightning Lad on his forays into Dream Girl’s boudoir.
Bierbaums: Tough, dedicated and self-disciplined, but not the iron-butt some of her teammates regard her as. She’s built many emotional barriers around herself because she’s all too familiar with and vulnerable to the intense personalities that surround her. When it’s needed (and she knows when), she’s the most empathetic and supportive of the team, as every Legionnaire who’s gone through a real crisis knows.
Comics Archeology: while I mostly agree with Shooter’s assessment, you can already see he’s going to shove his own fetishes into several of these comments.
And you already start to see the seeds of considering Dream Girl a vapid horndog.
Shockingly the Bierbaums are pretty spot-on about her.
LIGHTNING LAD
Shooter: One of the reasons for his sister’s retiring personality. He is a showman, a proud, powerful exemplary hero. A confident, dominant man, man enough for the likes of Imra Ironass Ardeen. Certainly his revival from death has affected him. Doubtless he feels now that he has a great role to play – a mission. He is good. He knows it – he strives for it and will not be denied his place in the heroic limelight.
Bierbaums: The original Garth was a charismatic bad boy who nobody was quite able or willing to straighten out. He finally found real valor in himself when he sacrificed his life for Imra. When the team tried to resurrect him, they instead gave him Proty’s personality, which was the heroic, dedicated and slightly unbalanced Garth we knew during most of the Legion’s run.
Comics Archeology: Shooter was definitely trying to make Lightning Lad a more classic hero, based on his description.
I’m truly baffled by the Bierbaums thinking there is such a strict distinction between the personality of Lightning Lad before and after his resurrection: there wasn’t really a visible difference in how he acted. Especially since before his “death” he had barely any personality to speak of, but that’s just because all the Legionnaires had just started developing one!
DUO DAMSEL
Shooter: The only girl with a frail enough ego to make Bouncing Boy secure. She is bright, pretty, clever, thoughtful and artistic chick with a lousy self-image. One of the best catches of the Legion girls – note that B.B. got her! All the way through the courtship he probably told himself, “Naw, she really can’t like me.” And with the same ruthless resignation he faces danger, he courted and charmed her until he got her, surprising no one more than himself! She recognizes Chuck’s value. She even recognizes her own value, but insists on judging herself against standards carefully selected to paint a failure. Like the hopeless crush on Supes. I’m sure there were some jokes made about the two for one bit long before B.B. courted D.D. – probably the Legion guys were afraid of messing with D.D. because of the razzing they’d get, weird sex humor and suspicion of troilistic perversion, etc. I’m sure D.D. got some funny looks occasionally from the Legionnaires. A girl with a power so weirdly suited to weird sex (and not much else) has reason to wonder what’s behind her backs.
Bierbaums: Luornu has a triple personality, an oddity they try to suppress on Cargg. The “purple” Lu is reserved, well-behaved, the “orange” Lu is a trouble-making rebel and the “white” Lu (the one Computo killed) is nervous and fatalistic, the repository of all the anxiety the combined Triplicate Girl suffered through. Usually, the “purple” personality is dominant, making Triplicate Girl one of the strongest links in the Legion chain. Usually.
Comics Archeology: Shooter does a nice assessment of the character. Even the “lousy self-image” tracks with her personality prior to the Shooter run, although it wasn’t too evident because Shrinking Violet was so blatant about being the team’s, uhm, shrinking violet.
Shooter being Shooter he has to bring up weird sex, but come on, how could you NOT with this character?
The “triple personality” stuff from the Bierbaums is a bit of a spoiler about her future development, when compared to current retrospective. While I don’t dislike that interpretation, the fact that they JUST talk about that makes me think they didn’t really care for her pre-5YL development.
PHANTOM GIRL
Shooter: No wonder Ultra Boy worships her. She is bright, pretty, thoughtful, sensitive and charming. She also knows Ultra Boy well, she understands him better than he understands himself. She sees the good in him, but she surely knows he is unfaithful. I imagine she doesn’t care, she accepts it as part of the price she pays – just as she accepts dealing with his negativism. I suspect she can manuever him pretty handily, and wind him around the finger of her choice, though he doubtless believes he is running the show and she isn’t on to him yet.
Bierbaums: Strongly driven to rebel against her stuffy, disapproving elitist mother, but also has lots of tendencies to follow in her mother’s footsteps. Sort of the snooty cheerleader who sneaks a smoke in the girls’ room.
Comics Archeology: another case where the Bierbaums seem to be basing their comments entirely on the version they wrote. They were the ones to introduce both her mother and Phantom Girl’s rebellious streak, which I didn’t really see being a thing before they got their hands on the character.
Shooter’s comments seem spot-on to me… except the point about Ultra Boy being unfaithful.
I don’t know what Shooter is basing this on, as the “dumb jock” interpretation is decades after his run. But you may start to notice that a lot of the guys he describes sleep around.
CHAMELEON BOY
Shooter: Hmm. A little paranoid, but he is a fighter. He knows people stare at him, but he is almost defiant. His personality is reminiscent of a slightly militant black, circa 1969. His relationship with Proty I and II should not be overblown. Cham of all people would not patronize a truly intelligent creature. Despite the Weisinger-era “dialogue” of the Proteans, I suspect they communicate simple feelings or pictures and are not human-equivalent. I doubt he resents L.L., but he may be jealous of Saturn Girl’s rapport with Proty, his pet. Cham is unique, for a shape shifter he can identify with beauty the other Legionnaires misses. He could turn up with a shaggy, horned alien chick as easily as Elwinda. Liberal, he is – even philosophical. And probably a little kinky.
Bierbaums: Another collection of contradictions. Mysterious, unfathomable, utterly alien, the consummate detective and spy. But also emotionally vulnerable, especially in matters involving anti-alien bigotry and the secretive father who “abandoned” him, R.J. Brande. Cham lacks the patience to really enjoy the leadership positions he’s thrust into.
Comics Archeology: Shooter’s description makes me regret he didn’t give him more to do, because these are very interesting angles. I’m guessing he wasn’t a big fan of either Proty I or II, but his interpretation sounds way more interesting than what we got.
The 5YL era gave him a crucial spot in the Legion’s reconstruction, but I’m a bit surprised by the comment that he doesn’t enjoy the leadership because he lacks patience. Not only Chamaleon Boy is probably one of the Legionnaires WITH more patience… the Bierbaums are the one who don’t often give him stuff to do as leader!
COLOSSAL BOY
Shooter: Middle-class, yes, naive in the sense of firm belief in middle class values. Home, family, apple pie, flag, country, motherhood. He is convinced of everything – I doubt he is insecure. Everything seems black and white, value wise. Power-wise, height is one of the best psychological allies you can have. I’m certain he is unconcerned, even oblivious to things that worry other Legionnaires. He has an easy confidence others envy, and yet it sometimes works against him. Sometimes he blunders into easily avoided situations.
Bierbaums: Somewhat insecure, especially when comparing himself to some of his more “macho” teammates. Feels pressure to prove himself by hooking up with a steady girlfriend, and there just is no interesting partner within the Legion (until Yera comes along).
Comics Archeology: Shooter gives a great examination of the character. I’ve said before that Colossal Boy being among the most normal Legionnaires can make him a bit boring, and Shooter seems to be saying something similar.
The Bierbaums saying he didn’t have an interesting partner before his wife is strange considering he DID hook up with a teammate… who then turned out to be a shapeshifting spy.
STAR BOY
Shooter: A big fullback of a guy, he is slow, steady, faithful, honorable, reliable, loyal, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent. And dumb. And probably hung like a horse, which will be the deciding factor in Dream Girl’s settling down with him in that isolated observatory.
Bierbaums: Maybe not as bright or as deep as most of his teammates, but Thom is a good man who really believes in the Legion way. And he’s determined and earnest enough to make it work. Initially, he and Dream Girl were a good match, but as Nura matured, she came to overshadow him in virtually all areas except simple strength of character, and that’s left a gap in Nura’s life since they split.
Comics Archeology: what is with both Shooter and the Bierbaums calling him dumb? Poor Star Boy just can’t catch a break, even from his writers.
They don’t seem to have any respect for him, and his relationship with Dream Girl is viewed entirely as a sexual thing. Notice a pattern?
BRAINIAC 5
Shooter: A computer-brained adolescent. A child genius, who always has the right answer but most likely hasn’t been laid yet. His emotions have reached from soppy-sentimentalism and self-pity to tantrums of rage. He is, however, intellectually aware of his short-comings, giving him a bit of control. He knows his long suit, and he attempts to think his way out of immaturity just as he thinks his way out of everything else. On his side he has confidence, leadership and a healthy ego. His self-approach is confined to his personality, and in any situation against any odds he has faith in his brain. Setbacks merely inspire new intellectual efforts, he treats adversity as a problem to be solved. This is a strength and a weakness, for should a foe ever shake that self-confidence or somehow negate the value of Brainy’s mind, he would fall apart! All his eggs are in one basket, albeit an armor-clad one.
Bierbaums: Too intelligent for his own good. It seems like he doesn’t understand his teammates, but he actually understands them down to their tiniest impulses. He just hasn’t quite figured out how to process all that information. He’s forced himself to live in such emotional disconnect that he doesn’t always respect the emotional needs in his teammates he perceives so easily. His biggest hangup: Colu genetically manufactured him and hammered into his childhood psyche the notion that his happiness didn’t matter. His duty is to serve the common good of Colu.
Comics Archeology: aside from the near-pathological need to view the character through his sex history, this isn’t a bad viewpoint from Shooter.
Even though, considering where he’s coming from, the fact that he doesn’t bring up Supergirl at all is unexpected.
The Bierbaums seem to view Brainy through a bit of a regression of the character, since he HAD started to understand his teammates better during the Levitz run.
Is the comment about Coluan genetic engineering coming from a future story that I’m forgetting?
SHRINKING VIOLET
Shooter: More than a little like a female version of Ultra Boy. She is very hung up on Ultra Boy. She is very hung up on Duplicate Boy and is rather a depressive sort – but not as extreme as U-Boy. Just being a girl helps, because it is easy to relax into a follower’s role and her essential underlying morbidity is interpreted as shyness. She is very emotional, bright, attractive, and confusing to simpler types like Colossal Boy who can’t understand that she is happiest when wallowing in loneliness, suspicion, doubt and fear. She gets all her weird sex from Duplicate Boy and waiting and worrying just makes it sweeter.
Bierbaums: Painfully shy, insecure and possibly not quite competent in the early years. Probably was dealing with issues of sexual identity, not able at first to accept her lesbian nature. Never really had it together until she found Ayla, but after that, she becomes one of the Legion’s best.
Comics Archeology: Shooter’s interpretation is just TERRIBLE. Did she even ever show interest in Ultra Boy? Aside from her crush on Duplicate Boy and ONE date with Matter-Eater Lad, I don’t recall her showing interest in any other boy.
I’m not really sure if the Bierbaums are basing their idea that she had trouble with being lesbian on Shooter’s comments: yes Shrinking Violet used to be shy (IT’S IN HER FREAKING NAME), but that is a hell of a jump.
SUPERBOY
Shooter: This could take volumes. But it won’t. He is the most complex character, and the best. Not for nothing is this guy the greatest hero ever. He is in control of himself, his life and his power, incredibly so. A fantastic person.
Bierbaums: He’s basically what we tried to turn Mon-El/Valor into – the greatest hero of them all, the standard by which all that follows would be measured. For the Legionnaires, his presence is something akin to a contemporary club of U.S. presidents being joined by Abraham Lincoln.
Comics Archeology: unsurprising that Shooter has boundless respect for Superman, given his history with the character.
I don’t think the Bierbaums did a great job in turning Mon-El into his equivalent (other writers do a much better job).
SUN BOY
Shooter: Your typical upper-middle-class happy, well-adjusted A & B student, put-together fun guy. He doesn’t have to screw Dream Girl, he undoubtedly gets enough action on his own.
Bierbaums: He turned out during our run to be a tragic hero, raised on the notion that you had to win, no matter what the cost. He really tried to rise above the fuzzy morality of his upbringing and win within the rules, but that meant pushing himself beyond his limits and he suffered a nervous breakdown. Probably never fully recovered from that, leaving himself all too vulnerable to corrupting influences during the Great Collapse of the Five-Year Gap.
Comics Archeology: notice the truly stark difference here. Shooter considers Sun Boy as kind of generic hero, and even his weird sex angle amounts to the fact that Sun Boy gets laid a lot.
Compare with the Bierbaums who are 100% basing the entire description on their own interpretation: EVERYTHING they mention comes from his 5YL character assassination.
BOUNCING BOY
Shooter: Self-effacing, insecure, burdened with feelings of inadequacy, and yet – he is more together and competent than most people suspect, especially himself.
Bierbaums: A great guy. Fun, supportive and far more valuable a team member than anyone realized. Made the most of everything he had.
Comics Archeology: I agree with both assessments. Bouncing Boy rules!
ULTRA BOY
Shooter: For whatever reason in his background he is kind of a depressing person. He equates being negative and sober and worried and dull with being serious about what he is doing. His humor is strictly sardonic, a kind of black humor. He is always certain that the worst will happen. Even Phantom Girl, the love of his life, is a source for more dire imaginings on his part. He is certain she will die, or be hurt, and is vastly overprotective. On the good side, he is strong, solid, dependable and absolutely devastating in anger. He angers easily. He bears authority well and can lead, but his judgment is suspect – it is occasionally bent by his bleak outlook and a system or priorities that puts Phantom Girl over everything. He is, however, selfless and bright and willing to risk his own life often in a morbid, intense, almost passionate rage. Ultra Boy would be hell in bed. He undoubtedly, however, makes gentle, tender (and expert) love to Phantom Girl and saves his occasional forays into the bizarre for someone less angelic to him – say, Dream Girl. This guy is probably the Legion’s closest to being a mental case. Though he would deny it, he needs a Bouncing Boy type – I think he is smart enough to know that. But Bouncing Boy is gone now… hmm…
[note: Shooter is referring to the fact that Bouncing Boy was not in the team when he wrote those comments]
Bierbaums: A street rat with a heart of gold. Raised in the squalor of an amoral frontier world, he picked up from his parents an unyielding sense of morality. From his hardscrabble background he picked up the resourceful intelligence of somebody who’s survived a thousand scrapes that would have wiped out those of us from more genteel worlds. Yes, he’s overmatched by Tinya’s charms and powerful personality, but it all works out. Given some of the secrets he’s carrying around, he desperately needs to be under-estimated, and coming off as Tinya’s big, dumb plaything doesn’t hurt that cause.
Comics Archeology: this is just night and day. Shooter clearly has A TON of ideas on Ultra Boy (that’s the longest description he gives) and it has a truly unique approach. I’m guessing he was in the middle of brainstorming an Ultra Boy storyline when he wrote those comments, even though basically nothing he mentions later shows up in his run.
Whereas Shooter seems to be considering turning Ultra Boy into an early anti-hero, the Bierbaums were of the completely opposite view.
I’ve already made fun of the ridiculous lengths they went through in order to hype him, and they’re STILL doing it years after ending their Legion run!!!
MON-EL
Shooter: He is, as Cary Bates defined him, basically insecure. Contrary to what many people say, he has not had a thousand years of life to his credit, but due to the homeostatic nature of the zone, he has had the same year 1000 times.
Bierbaums: An immensely heroic figure. Perhaps the greatest hero of all time. Utterly dedicated to serving others and paying whatever price is necessary for the common good. A thousand years in the Phantom Zone? No sweat.
Comics Archeology: I have no idea why Shooter would even want to take away from Mon-El the fact that he experienced 1000 years in the Phantom Zone, that’s one of his defining traits!
MATTER-EATER LAD
Shooter: A student, a scholar, a leader type, but not in the Legion. He is heroic and loyal and dedicated and intelligent and clever and too valuable to be out of place in the Legion. As a Legionnaire he brought up the rear and his valuable qualities were largely wasted in a context where they were not in demand. One doesn’t negotiate with Mordru. He is a fine person who had to come from behind, in the sense of having a dismal background, to succeed – he has, and will.
Bierbaums: He was the one LSHer who understood that life was meant to be fun and being a Legionnaire was the greatest gig in the universe. Absolutely understood how ridiculous his power and code name were and loved being a living, breathing Monty Python routine.
Comics Archeology: Another stark difference. Shooter hypes up M.E.L. without even bringing up his ridiculous power, while the Bierbaums only consider him a clown. Which is weird because the jokey 5YL version DOES show hidden depths here and there!
ELEMENT LAD
Shooter: Hmm. An introvert who covers with snappy patter! Could be gay, who knows? He is confident, almost arrogant. He has a right to feel very special, and his is an overwhelming power.
Bierbaums: Came out of a society that had to teach their offspring from infancy not to turn their playmates into molybdenum anytime they get into a fight over the tinker toys. So he’s a youth of vast discipline and spirituality. That’s meant all these years he’s been secretly, methodically dealing with the unspeakable horror of Roxxas’ slaughter, coping in his own intensely private way. That’s meant there’s such disconnect between Jan’s physical impulses and what his mind allows him to act upon, that questions of sexuality (yes, he’s gay) are almost irrelevant.
Comics Archeology: Yep, this is the whole reason I decided to bring back those comments! While reportedly it’s not the Bierbaums who came up with the “Shvaughn is Sean” plot (it was Al Gordon), they were definitely on board with that.
And it seems to me that Shooter’s throwaway “he might be gay” comment is the source of the fandom idea that Element Lad has always been gay.
Well, the pink costume might have helped a little.
But those are the insane roots of the Shvaughn retcon! Shooter’s comments pre-date her (she’s a Levitz character), but since she becomes Element Lad’s girlfriend… there were only 3 possible ways things could have gone.
A) ignore Shooter’s throwaway comment (the solution that that makes the most sense)
B) say Element Lad is bisexual (even more unheard of in 1992 comics than a gay character)
C) the insane retcon we had
LIGHT(ning) LASS
Shooter: Not as plain as you paint her. Perhaps she has developed since the disguise incident (when she was surely on super-hormones!) She is fairly bright, and a samaritan, a good match for Timber Wolf when who needs a non-dominant, pleasant and patient girl. I think she is actually very feminine. She used to wear high heels!
Bierbaums: She’s mother earth. The sweetest, most nurturing, most empathetic person you’ll ever meet, the ultimate expression of the well-adjusted, naturalistic culture of Winath. She also deals beautifully with life’s darkest moments, though her emotional Achilles’ heel is facing up to the pathological behaviors of her renegade brothers Garth and Mekt. Also secretly harbors an eternally unrequited love for… Saturn Girl.
Comics Archeology: oh boy, there sure is a lot to unpack here. Shooter has a rather well-rounded opinion of her, even better than how she was actually written in the 70s. The “disguise incident” refers to her impersonating Lightning Lad during his “death”, and you have no idea how happy I am that the Bearbaums didn’t take the “super-hormones” joke literally.
But their comments are COMPLETELY at odds with Lightning Lass’s characterization. “Well-adjusted” and “empathetic”? REALLY!? Lightning Lass was an emotional trainwreck when she was with Timber Wolf and she was incredibly abrasive and rude to everyone during Volume 3, what kind of character were the Bierbaums reading!?
Also the idea that she has a thing for Saturn Girl comes out of ABSOLUTELY NOWHERE.
DREAM GIRL
Shooter: I never believed that she scientifically changed Light Lass’ power. It could only have been White Witchcraft – and for some reason W.W. didn’t watch the Legion to know about her. Dream Girl is dumb. Her power is more or less hit or miss in value (though it is always accurate) and I’m sure her main service to the Legion is in her quarters after dark. She needs constant reassurance of her value, and since her Legion career has been less than stellar, the only way to get psychologically stroked is to allow herself to be physically stroked. By anybody. She has a need for love, adoration and reinforcement of her narcissistic self-image. Star Boy is either too dumb to realize this, or has resigned himself to it. His most fervent wish is to get her off to some godforsaken observatory somewhere, alone. Forever.
Bierbaums: Formidable. Her sexuality is a force on par with Brainiac 5’s intellect, Mon-El’s strength, Cosmic Boy’s dedication. In part because of her power and in part because she’s a very smart cookie, she can see many more moves ahead in the chess game of life than anyone else. And that’s pretty useful when you can turn any corruptible male into your pawn. Luckily, she works for the good guys.
Comics Archeology: these are both HORRIBLE interpretations. Both Shooter and the Bierbaums seem to almost actively hate Dream Girl and only see her as a vapid sex-obsessed narcissist that has no place being a hero.
The ONLY tiny bright spot is Shooter’s comment on her need to be validated by others, but besides that… yeah this might be THE worst of all descriptions.
PRINCESS PROJECTRA
Shooter: Was not a political admission. She is proud of her noble background and yet does not want to be separated from her friends by station. K.K. is a natural for her, because he’d act the same before the King of Razamataz as he would with Sam the Streetsweeper. She’d say, “I’m a Princess” and he’d say, “Far-out! Wanna screw?” Opposites do attract – her couth, class, cultural offset his rowdy behavior and vastly different culture. She is somewhat lost in this technological world, he is at home. She is a mystic, he has grown up amid science – and yet, perhaps the Oriental half of Val is more in tune with Projectra’s background. She is very duty-oriented, and to conduct herself in public, anyway, as a princess, is very important to her. She believes in her own nobility and that belief is the source of what courage, honor, loyalty and strength she has.
Bierbaums: A regal demeanor, with all that implies. Perhaps because of inbreeding within noble lines, she seems especially susceptible to some debilitating mental viruses, but Projectra has admirably rallied back from those difficulties.
Comics Archeology: This is particularly interesting because Shooter created Princess Projectra. The dynamic with Karate Kid does track, although I can’t picture ANY version of Karate Kid who would ever say “wanna screw?”… he’s always been the zen type, so what the heck Shooter?
Notice the Bierbaums not really caring for her. That mention of inbreeding to justify the couple of times Projectra got sick… ugh. You went there instead on the fact that she’s from a less medically advanced planet? REALLY!?
KARATE KID
Shooter: Definitely scrutable. Blunt. Forward, open, sometimes rash, impulsive, hot-headed. He is exactly as he seems. Courageous, loyal, and bright, believe it or not. He can lead, but mostly prefers to be alone or operate with relative autonomy. He’ll work with a group, but prefers many options to many orders. He can think deep, but doesn’t want to – he is, in many ways, an artist!
Bierbaums: Here’s a guy who’s mentally disciplined himself to such a degree that he can give Superboy a run for his money. The problem is, Karate Kid has trouble dealing with teammates who have so much more to work with and expect so much less of themselves. Well-matched with Princess Projectra, who also has occasional trouble regarding her teammates as worthy equals.
Comics Archeology: another character created by Shooter where his description doesn’t exactly track his own writing. Karate Kid WAS more impulsive during the 60s run than later, but I would never describe him the way Shooter does.
The Bierbaum description also goes places where Karate Kid never ended up.
SHADOW LASS
Shooter: A romantic, a busybody, probably a gossip and a bright, sexy, sultry, swinging chick who is a lot of fun for Mon-El.
Bierbaums: She’s a great hero, but also a bit of a schemer and manipulator. Has a dark side and can be a brat. All of which makes her a great partner for stuffy Mon-El, getting him to loosen up and enjoy life a little more.
Comics Archeology: yet another Jim Shooter creation; he has a rather straightforward image of her. The Bierbaums see her as a manipulator and a brat… why, exactly!? I would never have associated those words with Shadow Lass, where is this coming from!?
TIMBER WOLF
Shooter: Second to Ultra Boy as the Legion’s leading fruitcake. He is probably as neurotic as is Ultra Boy, but exclusively about his own identity. He covers his interior uncertainty with coldness and hostility. Fortunately, Light Lass is enough of a romantic to be turned on by this aloof stance. Ultra Boy thinks he knows himself while Wolf knows he doesn’t. This alone makes Wolf a more palatable personality, he is the type who will make wisecracks and noise to hide his inward uncertainty. He wants their approval and acceptance. Actually, being a goody-goody Legionnaire is hard for him, because he is more of the James Bond type, just a little vicious and nasty even though he’s with the good guys. I think Light Lass had to lead him by the hand to bed, but thanks to her, he undoubtedly does well there now.
Bierbaums: Our idea for Brin was that his Zuunium treatments were a kind of super-steroid, giving him powers, but also warping his mind. We thought the look of his Cockrum appearance was by far Brin’s best and tried to establish that as his actual native appearance, but never got that story published.
Comics Archeology: unlike Ultra Boy, Shooter DID manage to characterize Timber Wolf in his run in a similar way to this description. The Bierbaums are stuck with their own retconned version, as they often seem to do.
WILDFIRE
Shooter: Bleah. How dull. A hothead, yes. A bright but juvenile person who is dull, dull, dull.
Bierbaums: He always seemed like the flattest, most two-dimensional character of the lot. But in a way, he was the perfect character to take the role of the inevitable upstart, the loudmouthed newcomer who just doesn’t understand or respect the greatness that proceeded him. I liked him a lot more as the traditional hero of his original couple appearances, and he was on his way to being one of my all-time favorites, until they came up with the Marvel-inspired hothead business.
Comics Archeology: I had to end with THE worst description. I can simply disagree with Shooter because Wildfire is one of my favorite Legionnaires EVER, but at least I can respect him for just ignoring a character he doesn’t like.
The Bierbaums are impossible to understand for me, as they usually are.
First of all, do they REALLY not understand the concept of a “jerk with a heart of gold” character!?
But most importantly: what the frunt does it mean that they preferred them when Wildfire was “the traditional hero” and not the hothead?
HE’S ALWAYS BEEN THAT WAY!!! For crying out loud, HIS ENTIRE FIRST STORY is about him boasting why he’s the better than the entire Legion! The only discussion you could have about when he turns into a hothead is whether it’s in his first or his second appearance!!!
As I often wonder, when reading the Bierbaums… did they come from a parallel dimension where they published Legion stories that were completely different from the ones I read!?!?
Somebody get a fire hose and turn it on Shooter. I never knew what a complete horn dog he is. After he’s been hosed down, Dreamy should slap him a few dozen times. She’s far better than he thinks she is.
Even though the 60’s Legion has occasionally been accused of being the horniest team in comics, we don’t actually know much about how sexuality is viewed in the 30th century. Under the comics code authority, sexuality really couldn’t have been explored. Extrapolating from today, rather than from the time of publication, I’d venture that homosexuality or bisexuality are no big deal. Vi is likely bi and after dumping Duplicate Boy, she and Ayla simply clicked. Even while Ayla was trying to get with Pol, in hindsight, she belonged Salu.
It was never explicitly stated, but it appears that Pro-Femme was legal and ordinary on Earth, until the Dominators took over. The Dominators only caused a scarcity of it because of disruption to Earth’s supply chain. I can’t imagine them caring about any Earther’s genders. The Science Police had to have known the truth about Sean and simply didn’t care, because it had impact on their worth or duties as an officer.
Granted that I’m one of this site’s never-read-Legion-comics readers, but these are all just terribly off base.
Beyond that their assessments say way more about their writers than they do about the characters.
Shooter sounds like women instinctively cover their drinks when he approaches then remind each other not to get cornered by him. The kind of guy who cannot fathom any man not making every single decision in their lives without considering their dick first and foremost.
Meanwhile the Bierbaums sound like bloviating jackasses who only pause authoritatively talking out of their own ass long enough to enjoy the pungent aroma being emitted.
If I had to spend more than 5 minutes in any of their presences I would have to start either drinking again or begin committing felonies. Once begun, both would be difficult to stop.